Advertisement

Electric Cars Can’t Handle Cold Weather? Myth Busted

 
21,911 views Nov 30, 2010
Follow Nikki

2010 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 Cold Weather Testing

2010 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 Cold Weather Testing

2010 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 Cold Weather Testing

Enlarge Photo

We’re big fans of Mythbusters here at AllCarsElectric and love busting some of our own myths. 

So we decided to test a myth we hear time and time again: electric cars can’t go very far in the Winter when in-cabin electric heating zaps the power from the battery pack.  

We put on our thermal underwear, grabbed a warm coffee and headed out into unseasonably cold weather with a 2011 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 to see just how the sports car coped with ice, snow and a raging cold northerly wind. 


As luck would have it our car for the weekend was exactly the same vehicle we borrowed in October, so we were able to draw a good comparison between the two weekends in true Mythbuster style.

Fully charged, warm inside

As we pulled out of Central London and headed west down one of the many freeways radiating out of the U.K’s capital the entire U.K. was under severe weather advisories for heavy snow and extreme cold. 

While the temperatures we were set to experience were mild in comparison to a severe north east Winter we were promised temperatures as cold as 14 °F, with daytime maximums barely creeping above freezing point. 

But this didn’t phase the Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5. With powerful seat heaters and a fully electric heater providing enough warmth to make the cabin more than cosy, the Tesla forged forward into the encroaching darkness. 

Driving snow, not driving slow

About 40 miles before our destination snow started to fall. Initially light, the snowfall became heavier until our car registered an outside temperature of around 25 °F. 

At this point the Tesla, still in Range mode, was predicting enough power for at least another 80 miles. On arrival, the on-board computer predicted a further 40 miles in range mode was possible. 

Sure footed

The next day, we took the Tesla on an exhaustive trip designed to give it a thorough working out. First, a 60 mile freeway trip at 70mph, followed by a further 80 mile meandering route through some of the southwest of England’s most challenging roads. 

With the temperature below 27 °F for the entire trip and temperatures dropping to an indicated 20 °F while driving through the iconic Cheddar Gorge, our test car didn’t put a foot wrong, climbing up the 1,000 feet twisty road with ease. 

Computer controlled traction control

Even with the best will in the world we just couldn’t make the Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 lose grip while driving. The Tesla’s traction control made sure it stayed pointed in the right direction, even when we drove on sheet ice. 

In fact, the only way we could force the Tesla to slide around was to find a deserted parking lot and turn the traction control off. 

Dead camera before dead car

We’d planned to film our frigid fun, but it turned out our camera equipment just couldn’t handle the cold and switched off as soon as it was exposed to the extreme windchill. No such problems for the car, however, which kept on providing heat, power and entertainment for a whole weekend. 

In total we used just over 140 kilowatt-hours of power over the weekend, resulting in a massive 450 miles of snow-filled fun. 

We struggled to find a difference in performance, range or energy consumption between our cold-weekend and our mid-Fall test-drive. Whatever we threw at it, the 2010 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 kept going. 

Our only problem? A frozen trunk mechanism after the overnight temperature dipped below 16 °F which required a few hours of driving to thaw out. 

Other than that, we’d have to say that Tesla have managed to change our perception of Winter electric vehicle motoring. 

Myth Busted. 


HI-RES GALLERY: 2010 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 Cold Weather Testing




Tags:
Posted in:
 
Contribute
Send us a tip Comment Contact the editor
Follow Us

 

Have an opinion?

  • Posting indicates you have read this site's Privacy Policy and Terms of Use
  • Notify me when there are more comments
Comments (70)

  1. Noel Park Posted: 11/30/2010 12:21pm PST

    Nice work. Well done! Thanks.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  2. B-Man Posted: 11/30/2010 1:14pm PST

    Wow, excellent review Nikki, and an excellent showing from the 2011 Tesla Roadster in icy, cold weather.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  3. lne937s Posted: 11/30/2010 3:21pm PST

    I think Nissan proved that EV's can handle cold weather a while ago with the Prarie EV serving as the vehicle for the National North Pole Exploratory Team for many years:
    http://www.nissanusa.com/leaf-electric-car/news/general/nissans_pursuit_for_zero_emission_mobility#/leaf-electric-car/news/general/nissans_pursuit_for_zero_emission_mobility
    "The Prairie EV, with no Nissan support or maintenance, served as the daily transportation from the base research station to the town and airport and, most importantly, while conducting meteorological observations. Zero emissions vehicles are critical for such use in order to not contaminate the research data with CO2 emissions."
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  4. fb_100000458268753 avatar Neil Blanchard Posted: 11/30/2010 7:56pm PST

    So, it bettered the Leaf's EPA rating with ~311Wh/mile in the freezing cold! (The Leaf is rated to use 340Wh/mile.)
    Good job -- keep bustin' those myths!
    Sincerely, Neil
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  5. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/1/2010 1:45am PST

    The more we can prove that EV's are 'just' cars the better for all of us.... Great job Nikki!
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  6. Sean Phelan Posted: 12/1/2010 4:39am PST

    I just saw this article after a comfortable, trouble-free two day trip to Stratford upon Avon in a Roadster 2.0. We did 220 miles, used about 75KwH and I don't think the outside temperature ever went above freezing. Recharging at the hotel is essential, of course; I always call in advance to confirm that it will be possible. We used MUCH more power on the return trip (M40 motorway all the way) than on the outbound leg, which we did slower and on country roads. Cruising speed is really the only material factor affecting range; temperature, in my experience, is irrelevent.
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  7. fb_100001444034909 avatar Richard Marks Posted: 12/1/2010 4:48am PST

    This was very interesting. I am an electric vehicle engineer and have worked on everything from EV1 to my own company's EcoVElectric. Couple of questions: was the Tesla maintained in a garage while it was recharged overnight? What was garage temperature? You mentioned you put on your therml underwear; was that necessary? I find it hard to believe your kWh and miles traveled? Heated seats draw about 40W on low (X2 for both seats) and the electric heater needs at least 1000W to 2000W if it is going to meet windshield defrost stds. and provide you some cabin heat; so how much heat did you really use? (In 1 hour, how often were the heater and the heated seats on? Lastly did you ever take your foot completely off the throttle while taking a turn on an icy road? Please understand, I am not knocking what you reported, just trying to learn objectively.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  8. fb_535830066 avatar Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield Posted: 12/1/2010 5:30am PST

    Hi Richard,
    The car wasn't kept in a garage, and we used Range mode charging which I believe uses more power at the wall.
    Thermal underwear? I did spend some time outside the car taking photos, but no, it wasn't necessary!
    As for the heating, we treated the heating just like any other car, turning it on and off as needed to provide an adequate amount of heat. I would estimate the heated seats were turned on for about half the time, and the heater on low most of the time once an optimum temperature was reached.
    As for the icy roads? No, smooth acceleration and sensible corning - although we did try hard to make it lose grip with sudden acceleration many times.
    Nikki.
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  9. JPW Posted: 12/1/2010 6:20am PST

    But this didn’t phase the Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5
    Don't worry, its three-faze motor guides it easily over eggcorns. . . .
     
    Post Reply
    -1
    Bad stuff?

  10. Dan Gilligan Posted: 12/1/2010 6:55am PST

    Would love to hear detailed experience driving in -10C and below conditions
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  11. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/1/2010 6:55am PST

    Richard, I can confirm that I see very similar results to Nikki's with my Tesla Roadster. The heating and other loads really have little impact on the range when compared to the impact of driving style. I just drive my car like a regular Joe and turn on the heat when it's required...
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  12. Robert Posted: 12/1/2010 7:10am PST

    Richard: this is on Tesla's website found at this link
    http://www.teslamotors.com/roadster/technology/battery
    "In general, Lithium-ion cells cannot be charged below 0 degrees Celsius, which would theoretically prevent charging in cold environments. To overcome this cold weather charging obstacle, the Roadster is designed with a heater to warm the cells (when plugged in) to an appropriate charging temperature. If there were no battery pack heater, drivers living in cold environments would have difficulty charging and experience stunted driving performance."
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  13. fb_538140052 avatar Chad Schwitters Posted: 12/1/2010 7:23am PST

    When the car is plugged in, Tesla seems good about running power through the pack to keep it at a reasonable temperature. When you start driving it, flowing current naturally heats it up. The pack layout and location is pretty good about retaining heat. So there is very little performance degradation due to cold--it is kept at a good temperature, despite using extremely little extra power to keep it there.
    On hot days, it will heat up, especially if you drive it hard. But then Tesla circulates cooling fluid through the pack. That can lower your range by running the A/C compressor; but it's a heat pump so it really doesn't seem to be a big draw compared to pushing the car.
    The worst drain in winter is running the cabin heater. It is a resistive heater, so it can draw a fair bit of power (I can't remember the exact number, but I think it's about 3kW). However, between the seat heaters and the small cabin, you don't want to run it at full power for very long, so the drain in practice isn't bad.
    Here is a chart showing the worst-case hit to Tesla range assuming the heater--and A/C, and all other accessories--are on full blast:
    http://www.pluginamerica.org/drivers-seat/how-far-can-you-really-go-electric-vehicle
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  14. Edward Camuffo Posted: 12/1/2010 8:11am PST

    No one ever doubted that electric cars could keep passengers warm. Electric heaters have been around since.....electricity. It will, however, reduce the range of the car because the only source of energy to provide heat is the battery pack that powers the car. More important than cold weather is how an electric car performs in the snow and on a low traction surfaces. Rear wheel drive, no matter how "balanced" the weight of the car, is no substitute for four wheel drive, or even front wheel drive. Until a computer controlled four wheel drive system is used, with a motor on each wheel that is powered according to the traction available at each wheel, electric cars will not be a good choice for areas that get snow in winter. Two motors, to power the front and rear wheels, could also be a solution for four wheel drive in an electric car. By the way, a car with computer controlled individual motors on each wheel does exist. The "Elica" is an experimental car that was built in Japan by a college professor. It has six wheels, each of which has a motor. The power to each wheel is controlled by a computer, with sensors at each wheel that determine the traction available and the amount of power to be applied. A six wheel vehicle, of course, would not be marketable, but it just shows what can be done and the technology that exists today.
     
    Post Reply
    -1
    Bad stuff?

  15. Bert Posted: 12/1/2010 9:32am PST

    OK, that's for the Tesla, the $100,000+ roadster with the 220 mile range.
    The Nissan Leaf won't come even close to that. I have yet to see any real road tests on the Leaf and I mean REAL road tests.
    Go 75 on an AZ highway for 25 miles on a 100-110 degree day with the A/C on. That's typical weather from May into September.
    Or in a hilly area of Pennsylvania, New York, or other cold northeastern state in the dead of winter.
    Not everyone has a garage. How about it parker outside on a 20-30 degree night with a 30 mile commute?
    I'm saying here and now there's going to be some miffed customers when they find out that their $32,000 Leaf is getting a range of 60 miles on highway commute in the winter.
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  16. fb_1089324431 avatar Tom Saxton Posted: 12/1/2010 9:43am PST

    Can you share the actual energy data for the drive? For each date state of charge (% and/or ideal miles) and odometer at start and finish?
    Also, regarding energy usage, note that the Roadster screens report battery-to-wheel energy use which can't be directly compared to EPA wall-to-wheel ratings for the Leaf. If we can also get the energy used to charge after each drive, we can calculate the wall-to-wheel number to compare to other EVs.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  17. L. Dagg Posted: 12/1/2010 11:04am PST

    I live in Canada on the prairies where winter temperatures reach -40 degrees Celsius and lower during the winter months for weeks at a time. I believe in the merit of all electric but until you prove to me that these type of vehicles can withstand extreme northern winter climes I remain skeptical. In the temps that the Tesla was tested we don't even consider that the least bit cold but rather balmy.The myth busted is that it cannot handle extreme cold until proven otherwise. I submit that Tesla or the appropriate testers conduct a test in a Manitoba winter or even better test it in Thompson, Manitoba. If it survives those conditions then they can truly say the myth is busted!
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  18. fb_1089324431 avatar Tom Saxton Posted: 12/1/2010 11:48am PST

    Edward: Do you also believe that gas cars won't be a good choice for areas that get snow in winter until they have an separate engine for each wheel? What do you drive in the snow?
    Electric vehicles are inherently more suited to low traction situations since torque can be fully controlled independent of speed, something for which gas engines are poorly suited. Front wheel drive or all wheel drive would be better, and the people I know who drive the front wheel drive Toyota RAV4-EV in the snow rave about how good it is.
    Despite the Tesla Roadster's rear-wheel drive, we're getting very enthusiastic reports from Roadster owners driving in the snow.
    http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/4738-Winter-Performance
    Also, some information about the testing Tesla did on a frozen lake in Sweden in 2007:
    http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/slip-sliding-away
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

  19. scamripper Posted: 12/1/2010 12:10pm PST

    The news about "Electric Cars" is nice.cold weather with a 2011 Tesla Roadster Sport 2.5 to see just how the sports car coped with ice, snow and a raging cold northerly wind this is very useful information.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  20. R. Stocks Posted: 12/1/2010 12:17pm PST

    I would still like to see how it handles Edmonton, Alberta Canada winters where the climate can stay at -20 for the daytime highs. We have to plug our cars at night to ensure that they start in the morning. When parking at the local train station for 9 - 10 hours straight and nowhere to plug the block heater in. That would be a test in my books. I would love to have a electric automobile but until someone tests those environmental conditions and can tell me that it would work reliably. I am still on the fence about buying an electric car.
    Thanks,
    Robin
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  21. true Posted: 12/1/2010 12:30pm PST

    I agree with R. Stocks, let's see a test in actual winter conditions, ie. parked outside for 8+ hours at more than 20 below celcius. In those conditions regular vehicles have difficulty starting due to a lack of current from their very cold batteries,...
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  22. Lakawak Posted: 12/1/2010 12:35pm PST

    Also in true Mythbusters form, you tested ONE car and then extrapolated that to all of them.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  23. cold Posted: 12/1/2010 1:49pm PST

    Please feel free when you update the article once you drive in cold weather... 20F is NOT cold.
    Do a proper article and discuss how the car drives and performs after it has sat overnight at -30F, with daytime highs getting to -15F then (and only then) will you be able to start to have an educated opinion on cold driving/winter performance.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

     

  24. fb_527471544 avatar Brian Hall Posted: 12/7/2012 9:44pm PST

    Yeah, in Canada, 20°F is about time to start using long sleeves ... ;P
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  25. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/1/2010 1:51pm PST

    Lakawak... my results are similar to those reported by Nikki. My car is in an unheated Garage which has been at -1deg C for several days... the car just works when I want it. I also know that lots of Roadster's are in use in Norway where it gets seriously cold...
    This may not have been terribly scientific but I think it's a good stab at busting the myth...
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  26. Caroline Schroder Posted: 12/1/2010 2:17pm PST

    The Tesla does indeed sound very impressive on the basis of your test, but although a snowy 20 °F in Cheddar Gorge is impressive in its own right, the question of performance in cold, snow, and ice is not so much one of a longish weekend trip but of an entire winter, day in and day out, ice, slush and all. I would be curious as to how much the car had been driven between your first venture in October and this and under what conditions garaged, charged and driven, daily.
    It would be no surprise if the Tesla did not do well in high latitude extremes----many gasoline powered cars have their own difficulties in such extremes--or in tropical heat and humidity. The real question which seems to be emerging is how performance, particularly battery performance, may or may not degrade over months, and years, of use.
    One other question, however, would you be inclined to favor an on-board charger solution, if one existed, against unexpectedly harsh conditions or on the motorway at 70 mph for prolonged excursions?
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

     

  27. fb_527471544 avatar Brian Hall Posted: 12/7/2012 9:47pm PST

    There's a family guy in Norway north of the Arctic Circle who's had a Roadster for a couple of years. He then got a couple more for his wife and daughter. And is eagerly awaiting the Model S.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  28. Tom R Simenstad Posted: 12/1/2010 2:20pm PST

    This myth was new to me. I've been driving a 2000 model Th!nk City for 7 years. Right now we see 12 F/-11 C here in Oslo, Norway. The electric heater with timer ensures that I can enter the pre heated cabin wherever I park. A 15 minute pre heat takes 5-10 % off the driving range.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  29. Bert Posted: 12/1/2010 2:23pm PST

    Lakawak makes a good point.
    In addition, I'd like to see a follow up article performing this very same test in three or four years with these very same batteries.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  30. fb_538140052 avatar Chad Schwitters Posted: 12/1/2010 3:15pm PST

    A number of people here are concerned about REALLY cold weather. That's fair enough, but I don't think it's reasonable for Nikki to test it. Take a look at teslamotorsclub.com. There are a lot of owners from Canada, Scandanavian countries and Colorado mountains that are very happy with the battery performance as well as driving ability. You will want to trade the summer tires for winter tires, and it obviously can't handle steep drifts, but with 65% of the weight over the drive wheels and electronic traction control, it does extremely well as a snow car. Yesterday an owner described taking off quickly from a stop light while a 4WD SUV spun its wheels.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  31. ev enthusiast Posted: 12/1/2010 5:27pm PST

    we are all complaining about tests in the cold, tests in the hot, etc. etc.
    the heck with tests. lets get some evs on the road. customers will be the ultimate tests. they will tell us what works, what doesnt work, what needs improvement.
    if the first evs dont do well for someone in -1000 degrees, okay. they dont work well for them. there are a gazillion other people for whom they will work well for. lets get the first gazillion in electric vehicles.
    then we can start to address the remainder, and what needs to be done to deal with their special situations.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  32. ev enthusiast Posted: 12/1/2010 5:37pm PST

    all these car companies could give away one car in each of many different climate situations, and let the customers give them real feedback.
    this way the car companies will get honest feedback, and dont risk soiling their reputation with something that doesnt work well enough until improvements are made.
    and the users are getting free vehicles, so they wont have anything to complain about. they freely chose to be test pilots.
    people like to bitch and moan about problems. there is a solution to every problem, once the problem is known, and not being speculated about.
    need i remind everyone that gas vehicles have radiators that can overheat and freeze ? and all sorts of other parts that can break or stop working, that the ev does not have ?
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  33. fb_1001015277 avatar John Briggs Posted: 12/1/2010 6:46pm PST

    Does anyone seriously drive this type of sports car in the winter? Everyone I know with this type of expensive sports car garages it for the winter. Winters are tough on any car, never mind one with low ground clearance.
    Nikki is really not the right person to do this type of testing. EPA, or Nissan, or some other authority will need to test the range is the right conditions. I wonder if anyone has a dyno that is in an environmental chamber that can go down to -40 F? It would be nice to know the reduction in range with temperature. We all know it will happen, we just don't know how much and at what temperature.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

     

  34. fb_527471544 avatar Brian Hall Posted: 12/7/2012 9:51pm PST

    "We know", do we? What if some of the waste heat is used to maintain the batteries at optimum? "Science is belief in the ignorance of experts." - Feynman.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  35. ev enthusiast Posted: 12/1/2010 7:12pm PST

    i think the main point nikki was making is that our current evs will work in something other than the best of weather conditions.
    while she may not have experienced "north pole" conditions, it does show that the vehicle did well in a fairly cold environment.
    if another environment is more harsh, then we would need to find out what happens in those sorts of conditions.
    we dont need to have them survive the sahara desert or the north pole for them to take over 99.999999 % of the world.
    as i stated in other threads, it seems obvious to me that our evs will eventually have options on them, regarding weather conditions.
    why charge someone on the beach in california for something that is only required for freezing temperatures ? or why charge someone in a cold climate for something that is only needed for hot climates, etc. ?
    the customer has a choice. when you buy your battery pack, what sort of climate control do you need with it ?
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  36. ev enthusiast Posted: 12/1/2010 7:37pm PST

    all these car companies could give away one car in each of many different climate situations, and let the customers give them real feedback.
    this way the car companies will get honest feedback, and dont risk soiling their reputation with something that doesnt work well enough until improvements are made.
    and the users are getting free vehicles, so they wont have anything to complain about. they freely chose to be test pilots.
    people like to bitch and moan about problems. there is a solution to every problem, once the problem is known, and not being speculated about.
    need i remind everyone that gas vehicles have radiators that can overheat and freeze ? and all sorts of other parts that can break or stop working, that the ev does not have ?
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  37. Arthur Dent Posted: 12/1/2010 7:48pm PST

    I'm sorry but 20°F is NOT cold. We have picnics in that weather here in Ottawa. A car needs to function at -40°F if you hope to sell your cars in Canada.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  38. fb_61206378 avatar Antony Ingram Posted: 12/2/2010 2:22am PST

    By all reasonable measurements 20F IS cold. Any temperature suitable for snow and ice is cold, unless you'd like to deny that frozen water is a cold substance. It's unrealistic for Nikki to have tested the Tesla in anything colder than abient temperatures but freezing conditions are a good test for any vehicle and the Tesla passed this one. There are always going to be people who live in extremes of temperature and fair enough, EVs might not be suitable for these people yet, but the majority of people DON'T live in these extremes and for them, Nikki's article should provide useful reassurance.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  39. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/2/2010 4:14am PST

    So, it reached -2deg C here overnight and we had a couple of inches of snow. Guess what, the Tesla worked fine when I drove it this morning. I appreciate that this is not REALLY cold and the car MAY have issues in extreme temperatures, however for the majority of drivers it just works and we should celebrate the fact that EV's are real at last...
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  40. Chris Posted: 12/2/2010 6:28am PST

    I know this article isn't about a prius, but just putting it out there.. I've had mine for 3 years, and I always notice in the wintertime, up to 100 miles less on a full tank in cold weather. For example, in warm weather I get about 420.. 430.. yesterday I was bone dry at 330. It's just something I've learned to accept.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  41. Perry Posted: 12/2/2010 6:43am PST

    That's fine and good, but 20 degrees isn't that cold. With the exception of Florida, Hawaii, and southern California, all of the US gets colder than that. I'd like to know how an electric car fares in a Minneapolis winter, regularly reaching -20F.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  42. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/2/2010 7:06am PST

    Perry, please follow some of the links above.... lots of cars in Scandinavia which gets very cold. Here's one in Copenhagen recently http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=265387&id=18790602800
    Most of us are lay people and can't give you a definitive, scientific, answer. What we can say is that as drivers EV's work for us. Tesla has delivered more than 1,400 Roadsters in at least 30 countries... they are being used in extreme climates today.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  43. Stephen Matthews Posted: 12/2/2010 7:52am PST

    Freeways ! ?
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  44. fb_100001444034909 avatar Richard Marks Posted: 12/2/2010 8:25am PST

    Wow, lots of comments. Tom Saxton provided me with info Nikki did not fully disclose. Her reported kWh was not from the wall but from Tesla's own battery to wheel energy. Where a significant loss in EV's occurs in all the electrical items that run to support the EV. Tesla's gage won't show all the support electricity that the batteries have to provide for the vehicle to run. I know Tesla has a complete thermal management system for the battery pack. This system consumes energy over time. Nikki should have measured energy from the wall to charge the vehicle. Also probably the best test short of a dyno is to run until the car is out of charge and get miles on a charge summer vs winter. Has any one done this?
    Since there are a number of Tesla owners commenting, How is your max range today versus when the vehicle was new? I am interested in understanding how the battery pack is doing over time. Please let me know how many miles you have on your Tesla if you answer. There is a guy in Europe who reported having 40,000 miles on his Tesla. Great, but what has happened to his max range over time.
    Lastly, EV's are extremely efficient so small changes affecting operation have big effects on overall range. Winter is directionally bad for EV's. Excluding the cabin comfort issues, the tires are stiffer, the air you drive through is thickner, your oils/greases are thicker, your batteries require thermal mgmt or you lose even more tange.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

     

  45. fb_527471544 avatar Brian Hall Posted: 12/7/2012 10:03pm PST

    There's another dude who put 40,000 miles on his Roadster -- and lost ~5 miles of range. In Alaska. The cold was benign and preservative, it seems!
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  46. Brian H Posted: 12/2/2010 9:39am PST

    John Briggs;
    -40°F? That's nuthin'! You should try -40°C!
    Oh, wait, they're the same ...
    ;p
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  47. andy Posted: 12/2/2010 10:20am PST

    Nikki, it would be interesting taking out a leaf in the snow. I find automatic cars are easier to drive in the snow and the torquey nature of the E.V may find it easier to get through the slush and ice. Also interesting how about using it overnight parked on my drive, then using the wireless auto defrost etc
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  48. fb_535830066 avatar Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield Posted: 12/2/2010 10:47am PST

    Andy,
    It's something I plan to do as soon as I can!
    Nikki.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  49. A Canadian Posted: 12/2/2010 10:53am PST

    The problem I have with your article is that the weather wasn't cold by my standards. Where I live in Canada, not the coldest part of Canada I should add, the weather can easily drop to -30C (that's -22F) and can even go as low as -40C (that's -40F). Many auto manufactures preform cold weather test in locations such as Thompson Manitoba where these cold temperatures are reached frequently during the average winter. If the Tesla can pass a cold weather test there, I'd agree it can handle cold weather.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  50. albert miller Posted: 12/2/2010 11:56am PST

    Where I live, it's 177 degrees daytime and -177 degrees night time. How will it do in these conditions? #36...you made the most sensible observation.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

     

  51. fb_527471544 avatar Brian Hall Posted: 12/7/2012 10:04pm PST

    In general, how do you find life on the Moon?
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  52. Khadgars Posted: 12/2/2010 1:19pm PST

    Telsa and the Chevy Volt both have excellent thermal management systems for their batteries. I'm not surprised at all that the Telsa Roadster performed well, the Chevy Volt has also been tested in even worse conditions.
    The problem is when you get to vehicles like the Leaf and other EV's that don't have proper thermal systems in place. I have a hard time believing the Leaf would be able to perform decent at all at freeze or below temps or well above 100F for that matter.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  53. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/2/2010 4:42pm PST

    Did my usual ~180 mile round trip today. Mix of small roads and motorways (freeways). Temp around 0deg C for most of the trip and some snow. Plugged into the Level 2 charger in Southampton for a couple of hours while I visited family. I didn't notice any difference in performance or range although I drove slower in the snow. It really was just another trip in the car...
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  54. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/3/2010 7:57am PST

    this Tesla looks happy in the cold... http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=5720105&id=18790602800
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  55. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/7/2010 4:34am PST

    Tesla Roadster's enjoying the snow in Switzerland;
    http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=267367&id=18790602800
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  56. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/7/2010 4:42am PST

    Just done another 180 mile dash.... all week it's been averaging -3deg C. When I left in the early hours it was -6deg C. I appreciate this is not at all scientific, but I see plenty of abandoned ICE cars on the side of the road...
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  57. Kevin Sharpe Posted: 12/7/2010 4:51am PST

    sorry, the last post got lost somewhere... A Tesla driver from Lethbridge, Alberta reported "We just went through a stretch for 2 weeks of daytime highs of -20 Celcius";
    http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/4738-Winter-Performance?p=53554&viewfull=1#post53554
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  58. Kent Posted: 12/8/2010 9:05am PST

    Whether Tesla performs great in Manitoba winters is NOT the test of whether these cars make sense generally. An analogy: whether cell phones work well in Manitoba is NOT the test for whether cell phones make sense for most people. In fact, cell phones and electric cars DO provide great benefits. This simple cold-weather test merely suggests such cars can be made practical to drive in moderately cold weather. An electric car is NOT a gas car and each has different advantages. Thus, it's unfair to expect electric cars to always perform the same as a gas (or vice versa). Gas cars use toxic, expensive petroleum and produce far more noise and CO2 from the tailpipe and require far more maintenance and repairs. You cannot refuel your gas car at home. This does not mean gas cars never make sense. It's just electric cars excel in many ways. Just don't expect them to be all things to all people at all times
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  59. Nate Posted: 12/14/2010 11:14am PST

    I live in Northern Minnesota (USA) where the temps get -20 (F), so 22 above zero isn't a good test of "cold". Leave it unplugged and sit for a couple days at these colder temps, then what happens?! Very interested because I'm ready for an EV.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  60. Dan Posted: 12/15/2010 6:34am PST

    Boo Mythbusters. Agree with Nate. This is a pretty crappy test. The coldest place you could find is London? Come over to Minneapolis and try the test. The range requirements would work for me but I would never buy one until this gets tested for -20F or -50 windchill.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  61. Dave Posted: 1/17/2011 11:57am PST

    I wonder if incorporating a radioisotope thermoelectric generator using Americium (found in smoke detectors) or some other elemental isotope could be used to keep the battery warm enough for those subzero climates. You can't make a nuke out of it, but you can get some usable heat. The Russians have been using this for power generation (only 10% efficient w/ thermocouples) for decades. All you need is enough heat to keep the battery at 0C or greater.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  62. ROBERT STOCKBURGER Posted: 1/18/2011 9:16pm PST

    Has it ever been considered to design in the power pack a power generation unit to recharge sections of the battery banks on a rotational basis as they discharge to a percentile triggering recharging mode for that battery bank? Perhaps with a mechanical "Flywheel assist.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  63. Gord Posted: 1/20/2011 3:00pm PST

    I'm strongly considering purchansing the model S, and would be interested how the Tesla design holds up to my driving conditions. I live in Canada. Temperatures of -30 C are common in the winter, and I have to communte 60 km each way at 110 km/hr highway speed, often whith 70+ km/hr head winds (one way only of course). These are pretty extreme conditions, but I need a vehicle that can do that as easily as a calm summer day at +35 C. Love the temperate zone.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  64. paul Posted: 3/6/2011 1:28am PST

    yea sorry people in the uk but anything above
    -10 Celsius is warm... that's not winter.
    here is a winter chart for cold for you to understand cold **(these temperatures are with the wind chill affect taken into account):
    -10 to -20 Celsius - a bit chilly
    -20 to -30 Celsius - starting to get cold
    -30 to -40 Celsius - cold
    -40 to -50 Celsius - darn cold
    -50 to -60 Celsius - too darn cold
    anything below -60 and your so far north in Canada your near where Santa lives, head back south lol.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  65. Guess What? Posted: 3/29/2011 11:36am PDT

    HEY, Didn't someone drive an electric vehicle on the MOON a few years ago? What is the average temperature on the moon? Maybe someone should check that out and see how it was made and designed and then sell in Canada, etc! ;
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  66. Jim Posted: 3/29/2011 1:19pm PDT

    OK, that's for the Tesla, the $100,000+ roadster, Wow what a bargen and only $100,000 sure saves on gas !
    Oh ... real world 6 to 8 inches of snow on ground with sleet and snow on the roads ... now that is real world, lets try that test next I can not wait!
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  67. Lorin Coulombe Posted: 4/3/2011 9:43am PDT

    I live in Edmonton Alberta canada I was wondering if the car can handle temp in the 0 to -20 degrees farenheit this are our regular temp from nov to march
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  68. DaveMTL Posted: 4/24/2011 3:26pm PDT

    Though I also believe a true cold weather test would be nice, we have to be realistic as well. Much of the world has warmer weather than we Canadians and many of us have been seeing warmer winters. Minus 30C for a week just does not happen anymore here in Montreal. Remember that 90% of us live in the lowest part of Canada. For the rest, just plug in the car. We should be seeing a great number of charge stations around town very soon. And any self-respecting Canadian has a 110V outside next to his car. Block heaters come standard in almost every car in Canada.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  69. DaveMTL Posted: 4/24/2011 3:30pm PDT

    To my fellow Canucks, wind chill only applies to humans, not cars or batteries.
     
    Post Reply
    Vote
    Bad stuff?

  70. dhlewis avatar Dan Lewis Posted: 8/6/2011 6:19am PDT

    I'm a little disappointed in some of these comments. For those questioning why test drive in the UK's "not really cold" environment...let's try this: the author lives, writes and (presumably) drives in the UK. The car was borrowed (of all places) in the UK. The owner may not have wanted it shipped a few thousand miles away, as a hunch. Nothing against my Canadian brethren, but there's not yet a store in Canada...why harp on Canadian winters, as if that's the acid test of Tesla's viability? Tesla may never sell much in northern Canada...Coppertone doesn't either. This was a very valid test for those who live in cold (note, I didn't say "arctic") areas. Thanks to those asking good/real questions.
     
    Post Reply
    +1
    Bad stuff?

 

Have an opinion?Join the conversation!

Advertisement
Advertisement

Find Green Cars

Go!

Advertisement

More from High Gear Media

 
 
Green Car Reports
  • Follow Us
  • Twiiter
  • Facebook
 
 
© 2013 Green Car Reports. All Rights Reserved. Green Car Reports is published by High Gear Media. Send us feedback. Stock photography by Homestar, LLC.