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Nissan Leaf Slammed By Forbes, Destined For Failure?

 
30 10,086 views March 3, 2010

2011 Nissan Leaf prototype

2011 Nissan Leaf prototype

Enlarge Photo

On this site, general consensus shows that many readers do like the Nissan Leaf.  By most accounts, readers feel that the vehicle will be priced well, offer adequate performance, and be a sales success.  However, this is a site dedicated to electric vehicle and as such, our readers have developed a fondness to this type of vehicle.

Now if you turn to widely read, national publications such as Forbes magazine, the outlook is radically different.  According to Jerry Flint of Forbes, "The Leaf is more likely to be a sales failure than a sales success."  Flint backs his assumption with several key points including a lack of range in comparison to gasoline powered vehicles, a low top speed, high cost, and that refueling takes forever.  You can read more of Flint's though by clicking here.

What is apparent in the words of Flint is an oversight on many of the points mentioned.  For example, the Leaf hits 90 mph, more than adequate for most of the nation.  The Leaf travels 100 miles on a charge, enough for 95% of U.S. drivers.  The Leaf is anticipated to sell for around $30,000, a number in line with comparable vehicles.  Granted, Flint is right, an EV does take a long time to refuel.

We could go out on a limb here and say that the Leaf will be a sales success, but this is untested waters.  We wish Nissan luck with the Leaf and hope that it will be a breakthrough electric vehicle.

Source:  Forbes





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Comments (30)

  1. By Mark Posted: 3/3/2010 3:55am PST

    Forbes is a Republican journal, and we all know that the GOP are probably the least likely to be supportive of EVs. I don't know if it is the love of oil or the love of Saudi oil that gets us everything from GW deniers to ignorant people trashing EVs.
     
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  2. By Desertstraw Posted: 3/3/2010 4:37am PST

    I do not know if the Leaf will be a success even though I will probably buy one. But, I also bought a Sinclair computer, for those who don't know it was the first personal computer sold. It had little capability and you had to learn basic programming to use it. That was around 1980. Look what grew from it.
    I expect electric cars to do the same just faster. "A journey of a thousand miles starts with a single step".
    If the government were serious about electric cars, it would free the NiMH battery.
     
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  3. By Dean Posted: 3/3/2010 4:54am PST

    I agree with Mark's comments. Forbes magazine is know for its conservative slant.
     
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  4. By Z Man Posted: 3/3/2010 5:16am PST

    Forbes is not known for being at the cutting edge on anything. They probably reported the same thing about Henry Ford's first car -- compared to the horse it had a shorter range, was prone to tires blowing out, and was too noisy to catch on.
     
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  5. By Rb Posted: 3/3/2010 6:54am PST

    since when did being conservative mean you were against new technology? I agree that for 30k the range should be much higher. And how will this leaf perform in the cold? Poorly, I would guess like any other electric vehicle. I have a vehicle that I converted to all electric that I have 10k invested in and it has gotten 58 miles on one charge at 50 mph!
     
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  6. By JMD Posted: 3/3/2010 7:24am PST

    I don't know about Forbes' political bias as I rarely read the publication, but it seems that the readers here are at least as biased. It doesn't mean you're wrong, but it helps to acknowledge another's point of view without dismissing them based on their politics.
    I, for one, would love to buy an electric or hybrid car. However, it has to fit my needs, lifestyle and budget, which is what I think the author at Forbes was getting at. The Leaf sounds like a promising vehicle, and I hope Nissan does well with it, but I don't think it would work for me. My family takes trips of over 100 miles every couple of months, and with two children in car seats, I don't think the leaf would be big enough to use as a primary vehicle. As a second vehicle, the price is too high. Even if electricity were free, I estimate that it would take me 10 years to break even versus a $20,000 compact car.
    I'm excited at the advances that are being made in the electric vehicle market, but they're not there yet for me. Hopefully they will be soon.
     
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  7. rocky1 avatar rocky1 Posted: 3/3/2010 9:43am PST

    Forbes seems to parrot the economics as being impractical. There are a few things I think everyone will agree to; Oil will spike, gas prices will go up and speculators in oil will keep it that way. The economics even at todays pricing for the new technology radically change when gas hits $4.50 a gallon. After being involved in high tech manufacturing most of my career, I'm convinced that if the EV's can get a toehold, the cost reductions and innovations will just keep driving the prices down as the Manufacturer's compete. Nissan Leaf hasn't even released the first model and already have a plan for a revised battery with 150 mi range for the second generation. I personally evaluated my own buy decision if it were just Chevy Volt and Nissan Leaf. My personal analysis boiled down to how long would it take when driving a Volt before I realize that my battery power is being consumed by carrying around 500lbs of engine i most certainly will try not to use?
     
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  8. By Don Posted: 3/3/2010 9:53am PST

    $30,000??? I could buy 2 Toyota Corollas for that price!! Or I could buy 1 Corolla and bank the extra $15,000 for retirement! It would take about 30 years to save $15,000 in gas money by using an electric vehicle!!! They're feakin' nuts to be charging that much!
     
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  9. By Mark Posted: 3/3/2010 10:46am PST

    I think this is a great car for people living in bit cities.
    A commuter like myself, who never goes 100 miles a day.
    I could easily drive this for about 3-4 days without needing a charge.
    And seeing where the price of gas has been and where it's going to go, this will pay itself off in much less time that the 30 years stated by a previous poster.
    Add to that the minimum of repairs and service, and it's easy to see why it makes sense.
    I probably spend about $50,- a week on gas.
    That's $200 a month, $2400,- a year.
     
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  10. By Eric Loveday Posted: 3/3/2010 10:49am PST

    To Don, $32,000 minus $7,500 in incentives is in the neighborhood of $25,000. This is the expected price of the Leaf. A comparably equipped Corolla will exceed $20,000. The price difference you are suggesting is simply too much. The Leaf will become one of the cheapest EVs available when it goes on sale.
     
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  11. By Roy H Posted: 3/3/2010 11:34am PST

    The article by Jerry Flint, hinges its argument on the definition of success. According to him 30,000 is a failure, whereas most of us would consider that a success. His point is really about 2 years out, what will the yearly sales be by then? I admit that 150,000/yr is a pretty lofty goal, but how many does Nissan have to sell to make a profit? I think that Nissan does not expect to reach full production for 3 years, and this could be doable.
     
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  12. By Chris Posted: 3/3/2010 11:36am PST

    People like Mark are so ignorant. FORBES is read by Capitalists. NY City for example is a Liberal/Democrat Mecca like California, and in NYC alone there are about 750,000 millionaires (according to Forbes) and most Successful business people, most rich people and politicians in the USA are in fact Liberals. Bill Gates? Warren Buffett? Movie & TV Moguls? Wall Street execs? Fat cat lawyers? and so on are all mostly Liberals. So stop your lies and misinformation. I work at a Nissan dealer, and because we bust our ass every day, because we are truly entrepreneurs, we totally want these too. They accomplish the needs of MOST Americans, and on 440 which will be an option at your house or apt., you can do an 80% charge on the Leaf in 30 minutes. Forbes opinion is simply that, and although we all are allowed our, Mark is an ignoramus stuck in cliches and lies he's been fed by HIS handlers.
     
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  13. By Chris O Posted: 3/3/2010 1:09pm PST

    "Granted, Flint is right, an EV does take a long time to refuel." No, I'll not even grant him that. The Leaf has a 20 minute/80% fast charge capability. Furthermore: in practice you'll probably have say 20% charge left when using a fast charger, so you need to spend less than 20 minutes. I reckon your navigation system can tell you how many more KWH you need to get you through the day before plugging in at night so you can safe even more time by not bothering to fill up to 80%. What Forbes doesn't get is that electric driving means an entirely different way of living with your car.
     
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  14. By Noel Park Posted: 3/3/2010 1:22pm PST

    13 comments! Well done Eric. You must have touched a nerve somewhere, LOL. I'm a Chevy fan and unlikely to buy a Nissan, but I do have a lot of respect for Carlos Gshon. I would bet that he is more of a businessman than anybody at Forbes. I would bet that he has some pretty sophisticated market analysis to back his play in electric cars. I agree with Roy H at #12 and others that there is almost certainly enough of a niche to make the Leaf a success. And, when the next gas shock hits, as it most assuredly will, Nissan will be in a very strong position.
     
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  15. By Alexander Posted: 3/3/2010 3:40pm PST

    Andd if You stuck out of POWER???
    Here we come the emergency FAST charging trucks :) and You are good to go :)
    Simple as that!!
     
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  16. By Alexander Posted: 3/3/2010 3:42pm PST

    So DON'T be afraid of going out of power!!
    It is simple 10-20min charge from the toll truck!
     
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  17. By Eric E Posted: 3/3/2010 6:19pm PST

    I agree with Noel Park. It is easy to forget that the growth of demand for oil is far outstripping the the growth of supply. By a lot!
    The current low price of gasoline is unsustainable. Period.
    Nissan will be leading the pack in electric drive when gas prices jump again next year.
     
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  18. By Quixotix Posted: 3/3/2010 6:21pm PST

    Too expensive for a second car? It seems to me that families that have 2 cars usually have cars in the same price range. Besides, I would consider the Leaf my "first car" - the one I drive every day to work. The "second car" is the one I drive less often, only when I need more range.
     
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  19. By evnow Posted: 3/3/2010 6:36pm PST

    Flint & his ilk will be standing in long queues in front of the gas station as Peak Oil hits supplies. I'll go around the queue a couple of times honking in my Nissan Leaf !!
     
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  20. By Quixotix Posted: 3/3/2010 6:36pm PST

    Dumb question. Why would electric cars perform poorly in cold weather? How cold is cold? I would guess that most people getting $25,000 cars would have semi-heated (ie attached) garages. This would keep the batteries above freezing (or the water pipes in your garage freeze). And, since the Leaf lets you preheat the cabin while plugged in, the heating load shouldn't be too bad.
     
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  21. fb_100000432296831 avatar Ow Lafaye Posted: 3/3/2010 7:02pm PST

    In 20 years people will be exclaiming on how long an electric vehicle lasts. Engineering will simplify and batteries/recharging will improve dramatically. This is a huge market for the future and companies are going all out to find better technology in all aspects of electric vehicle manufacture.
     
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  22. By James E Posted: 3/3/2010 7:04pm PST

    The Leaf meets all of my criteria for a new vehicle and if they announce the price between 425 to $30 before the Govt rebate then I will buy one as soon as it is available.
    I also work in the electronics market and we will see EV prices drop year over year like every other component…
    Let’s get the EV’s on the rode!!!
     
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  23. fb_100000432296831 avatar Ow Lafaye Posted: 3/3/2010 7:11pm PST

    The Volt is already a failure and yesterday's technology before it even gets to market. GM needed to get it to market in less than 18 months versus the years it has been in development. GM still does not "get it". There will come a point in time where even a huge shift in focus will not prevent GM from bankruptcy once again.
     
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  24. By Eric loveday Posted: 3/3/2010 7:59pm PST

    To Ow, I have to say I partially agree with your Volt statement. It won't be yesterdays technology right away, but GM needs to consider an electric only vehicle real quickly. If people like the Volt and understand what driving an electric vehicle is like, they will want to switch from EREV to BEV. If GM doesn't have a vehicle available, buyers will look elsewhere. They need to anticipate this and to be ready for this. Once you go electric you will likely never go back.
     
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  25. By Steve Bruns Posted: 3/4/2010 8:23am PST

    Wow. Looks like "Big Oil" is pretty terrified that if ANY EV gets to market the game's over for them. Hope that's true. I'm not really sure how the Leaf could fail, seeing as how it will have no direct competition.
     
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  26. By jai Posted: 3/4/2010 1:36pm PST

    Success or not the technology itself is here to stay. So, whatever Forbes says today will be irrelevant tomorrow. To single out one EV with negative speculations and scaring people out of buying it is typical of the culture of hate and destruction in that magazine.
     
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  27. By Ed Posted: 3/4/2010 3:28pm PST

    I have my name on the list for a Leaf and I will definitely be ordering one. My goal is to become “oil free”. My motto is, “I can make electricity but I can't make gasoline!” For those who throw out the business case FUD of gasoline cars versus electric cars, I rarely see two critical items mentioned. First is maintenance. Electric cars require far less maintenance versus gasoline cars. There's no oil changes, no transmission, no radiator, etc. Second is the true cost of being addicted to oil. We fight wars over oil. Troops die and it costs Trillions. I don't think we have ever fought a war over electricity!
     
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  28. By B-Man Posted: 3/6/2010 8:54am PST

    Good point, Ed. We need to wean off foreign oil. It's painfully obvious. Nissan with their Leaf will be successful, it is pretty much a surety. Its cost is fairly competitive for one thing.
     
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  29. By B-Man Posted: 3/7/2010 2:39pm PST

    Bring those all-electric cars on!
     
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  30. By angie Posted: 10/28/2010 5:38am PDT

    I have been reading your post and I don't know what to say except that it caught my attention and you've provided informative points. I will visit this blog often. I think this is a great car for people living in bit cities.Thank you.
     
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